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Anyone have success with embryo past 6-8 cell on day3 ET or FET: getting conflicting info.

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#1 TryingForOur2ndChild

TryingForOur2ndChild
  • Global 100+
  • 791 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:London, ON
  • Dx:Male Factor

Posted 29 July 2014 - 11:21 AM

I'm 36 and about to proceed with my first FET. All my day-3 frosties are either 10 or 12 cells (good to excellent grade - see signature). I was told because they are past the ideal 6-8 cells that could mean they are not going to be successful, but when I did a bit more research on Dr.Google (lol) and found information on what looks like a legit website (www.advancedfertility.com) I found a statement that said "embryos with higher cell numbers, regular appearing cells and little or no fragmentation have a higher overall chance of implanting than do other embryos with less cells, more irregularity and significant fragmentation". 

 

I wanted to get anyones personal experiences, success stories or any info given to you from your clinic with regards to embryo success rate with embryos that have more cells than they typically like to see on a day-3.

 

Thank you in advance!  :)


See full journey details on my profile:

 

About Us:

​Trying to conceive since 2013 (male factor); Me: 39 yrs old; DH: 37 yrs old; low testosterone; very low sperm count; on Clomid for testosterone

 

~ 2014 ~ IVF Cycle #1:

 

Cycle Info:

- Antagonist protocol

- Retrieval: 22 eggs retrieved; 8 injected (ICSI); 6 fertilized; 4 embryos divided - 2 embryos are 4 cell grade 1, 1 embryo is 5 cell grade 2, and 1 embryo is 8 cell grade 2

 

FET #1 - medicated cycle (2014)

- transferred two day-3s: one 10 cell grade 1 and one 12 cell grade 2; Beta: BFN; approved to do a natural FET next time

 

FET #2 - Non-medicated cycle (2014)

- added Teva-Doxycycline 100mg (antibiotic) started one day before procedure: 1 tab 2xdaily until finished) 

- transferred two day-3 embies (1 is 10 cell grade 2 and 1 is 12 cell grade 2); took 1 tab of Apo-Diazepam (valium) 5mg 45mins before FET        

​- HPT = th_abfp.gifbanana.gifbanana.gifth_abfp.gif  Welcomed our little babygirl.gif in summer of 2015

 

~ 2016/17IVF Cycle #2: Project Sibling

 

Cycle Info:

Oct. 29: Retrieval - 23 eggs retrieved; will be a freeze all cycle

Nov. 2: Dostinex 0.5mg every other day for a total of 8 days has started to alleviate OHSS 

Nov. 4: Day 6 report: 5 embryos on ice... yay! 4 day-5s (4AA and 3 are 4BC quality) and 1 day-6 (5BC quality)

 

FET #1 - Non-medicated cycle (2017)

Feb. 6: start Teva-Doxycycline antibiotic100mg one day before procedure
Feb. 7: scheduled transfer at 11:45am; 1 tab of Apo-Diazepam (valium) 5mg taken 45mins before transfer; transfer of one 4AA blast

Feb.20: BETA - BFN; approved to go right into another natural FET with no cycle in between

 

FET #2 - Non-medicated cycle (2017)

Feb.24: CD3 - u/s and b/w= nothing said about lining; E2 19, LH 4.4 IU/L, FSH 6.6 IU/L, Prolactin 8.1 Ng/mL, TSH 2.22 IU/L, Progesterone 1.6 nmol/L, Glucose 4.1 - I requested (norm is 3.6-7.7); back on CD15; acupuncture 2x weekly until fet to try and bring on LH surge sooner than CD17.

Mar.6: OPK positive in the evening so looks like I will be going into the clinic tomorrow

Mar.7: CD14 - u/s and b/w= 11mm triple lining; E2 712, LH 32 IU/L

Mar.8: CD15 - b/w= confirmed LH surge was yesterday; E2 343, LH 8.12 IU/L; start Endometrin 3x/daily

Mar.11: start Doxycycline antibiotic 100mg (8 pills total) one day before procedure: 1 tab 2xdaily until finished

Mar.12: scheduled transfer at 10am of one 4BA blast; 1 tab of Apo-Diazepam (valium) 5mg taken 45mins before transfer

Mar.23: HPT = th_abfp.gifbanana.gifbanana.gifth_abfp.gif

​Mar.25: Beta #1= 788 hcg, Progesterone 107 nmol/L; RE happy with results so skipping beta #2 and going right to u/s

​Apr.4: had light bleeding last night so went to clinic where they did an u/s; too early to really see much but did see a gestational sac; u/s moved from Apr.8th to 15th

Apr.18: First u/s scheduled (at 8 wks).... omg there are twins!!! One had a heartbeat of 140 and the other only 80 so being referred to the head OB of internal fetal medicine as it looks like I may have a vanishing twin which RE said 50% of twins go down to one before the 2nd trimester.

 

 

 

 

 


#2 #[email protected]

#[email protected]
  • Cyclebase
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Posted 30 July 2014 - 01:06 AM

I have read that too many cells on day 3 can indicate that the embryo may burn out.  I think that 8 - 10 cells is best on day 3.  However, I have never heard that 6 is ideal.  But keep in mind, that sometimes the difference is just due to a few hours.  In other other words, you are just short of three days (retrieval is in the afternoon and they checked on day 3 in the morning) or longer than three days (retrieval was in the morning and they checked in the afternoon).  Good luck.


Me - 44, DH - 45
3 CONSECUTIVE IVF CYCLES AT 43 YEARS OLD = 16 eggs > 13 embryos > 10 transferred > 1 BABY!!!!


Years of anovulation (but this has saved me some eggs for my 40's!) and decreased count/motility.
4 years of trying naturally and tests - then surprise pregnancy in 2003, DD born 11/2003
6 cycles of clomid/iui - BFN, 2 cycles of FSH/IUI - x2 chemical pregnancy, 1 cycle of FSH/IUI - bfp! DS born 08/2006

2009 I decide I want another. Crazy I know - DH has had Vx.
2012 DH finally on board. Has TESE (super ouch).
03/12 and 04/12: FSH = 5, AFC = 4
IVF#1 - June 2012 - long lupron, 300 Bravelle, 150 Menopur, ICSI - 10 follicles, 3 eggs (WTF??), 2 fertilized, transferred 2 Day 3 4-cells - bfn.
IVF#2 - Aug/Sept 2012 - flare, 450 Bravelle, ICSI, 5 eggs, 4 fertilized, transferred 4 (2 8-cell, 2 10-cell) - chemical

IVF#3 - LAST CHANCE FOR ROMANCE![/b]
Oct/Nov 2012 - flare, lupron BID, 450 Bravelle, ICSI
Sept 15 - start BCP
Oct 11 - endo biopsy
Oct 14 - last BCP
Oct 17 - baseline: E2=286, start lupron microdose twice daily
Oct 19 - start 450 Bravelle
Oct 24 - U/S: 7 10mm follicles, bw: E2=964
Oct 26 - U/S, bw 9 follicles (all 10 -16mm), bw: E2=1867, lining: 9mm
Oct 28, u/s, bw 9 follicles (1 @10mm, 7 @16-17mm, 1 @23.5mm), bw: 3600+, lining: 10mm

Oct 29, u/s, bw 9 follicles (1 @12mm, 8 @18-21mm), bw: 5500+, lining: 10mm - trigger AND 450 Bravelle!
Oct 31 - ER 8 eggs!
Nov 1 - 7 fertilised!
Nov 2 - three grade 2 (all 4-cell), two grade 3 (2-cell and 5-cell) and two grade 4 (all 5-cell)
Nov 3 -two grade 2 (all 8-cell), four grade 3 (8-cell and 10-cell) and one grade 4 (6-cell)

Nov 4 - four good morulas, one border-line quality morula, two 10-cell embies
Nov 5 - ET of 2 blasts (2BB, 3BA), one cavitating morula and one other crap morula - NO FROSTIES!

Nov 10 - Day 10 - HPT ---- BFP!
Nov 14 - beta = 78

Nov 16 - beta = 179
Dec 7 - first u/s! 7w2d: CRL=10mm, HR=139
Dec 11 - first appt w/ high risk OB & another in office u/s (all good)
Dec 18 - u/s 8w6d: CRL=21mm, HR=172
Dec 27 - genetic testing and consult
Jan 11 - nuchal testing and IPS with soft markers (FTS) (for fun as will have already done NIPS) - NT=1.19mm = PERFECT
Jan 21 - 13w5d on u/s - we are having a boy!!!!!
July 24 - due! induced on July 6th - healthy, 7 lbs 2 oz at 37w3d - can't believe this happened!!

#3 TryingForOur2ndChild

TryingForOur2ndChild
  • Global 100+
  • 791 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:London, ON
  • Dx:Male Factor

Posted 30 July 2014 - 10:21 AM

#[email protected] - First off I want to say congrats on the newest addition to your family!! How is he doing? Secondly I really want to say thank you so much for responding. Do you by any chance recall how many cells would roughly be "too many cells on day 3"? I'm just wondering if 12 cells would be in that range. You do have a very good points that I never thought of with regards to when ER was and when they check them. I guess right now I'm just trying to get more information on roughly how good of quality my embryos are and if it will give better odds to transfer 2 day-3 embryos even though this is the first transfer I've ever had or would I have a high risk of multiples.


See full journey details on my profile:

 

About Us:

​Trying to conceive since 2013 (male factor); Me: 39 yrs old; DH: 37 yrs old; low testosterone; very low sperm count; on Clomid for testosterone

 

~ 2014 ~ IVF Cycle #1:

 

Cycle Info:

- Antagonist protocol

- Retrieval: 22 eggs retrieved; 8 injected (ICSI); 6 fertilized; 4 embryos divided - 2 embryos are 4 cell grade 1, 1 embryo is 5 cell grade 2, and 1 embryo is 8 cell grade 2

 

FET #1 - medicated cycle (2014)

- transferred two day-3s: one 10 cell grade 1 and one 12 cell grade 2; Beta: BFN; approved to do a natural FET next time

 

FET #2 - Non-medicated cycle (2014)

- added Teva-Doxycycline 100mg (antibiotic) started one day before procedure: 1 tab 2xdaily until finished) 

- transferred two day-3 embies (1 is 10 cell grade 2 and 1 is 12 cell grade 2); took 1 tab of Apo-Diazepam (valium) 5mg 45mins before FET        

​- HPT = th_abfp.gifbanana.gifbanana.gifth_abfp.gif  Welcomed our little babygirl.gif in summer of 2015

 

~ 2016/17IVF Cycle #2: Project Sibling

 

Cycle Info:

Oct. 29: Retrieval - 23 eggs retrieved; will be a freeze all cycle

Nov. 2: Dostinex 0.5mg every other day for a total of 8 days has started to alleviate OHSS 

Nov. 4: Day 6 report: 5 embryos on ice... yay! 4 day-5s (4AA and 3 are 4BC quality) and 1 day-6 (5BC quality)

 

FET #1 - Non-medicated cycle (2017)

Feb. 6: start Teva-Doxycycline antibiotic100mg one day before procedure
Feb. 7: scheduled transfer at 11:45am; 1 tab of Apo-Diazepam (valium) 5mg taken 45mins before transfer; transfer of one 4AA blast

Feb.20: BETA - BFN; approved to go right into another natural FET with no cycle in between

 

FET #2 - Non-medicated cycle (2017)

Feb.24: CD3 - u/s and b/w= nothing said about lining; E2 19, LH 4.4 IU/L, FSH 6.6 IU/L, Prolactin 8.1 Ng/mL, TSH 2.22 IU/L, Progesterone 1.6 nmol/L, Glucose 4.1 - I requested (norm is 3.6-7.7); back on CD15; acupuncture 2x weekly until fet to try and bring on LH surge sooner than CD17.

Mar.6: OPK positive in the evening so looks like I will be going into the clinic tomorrow

Mar.7: CD14 - u/s and b/w= 11mm triple lining; E2 712, LH 32 IU/L

Mar.8: CD15 - b/w= confirmed LH surge was yesterday; E2 343, LH 8.12 IU/L; start Endometrin 3x/daily

Mar.11: start Doxycycline antibiotic 100mg (8 pills total) one day before procedure: 1 tab 2xdaily until finished

Mar.12: scheduled transfer at 10am of one 4BA blast; 1 tab of Apo-Diazepam (valium) 5mg taken 45mins before transfer

Mar.23: HPT = th_abfp.gifbanana.gifbanana.gifth_abfp.gif

​Mar.25: Beta #1= 788 hcg, Progesterone 107 nmol/L; RE happy with results so skipping beta #2 and going right to u/s

​Apr.4: had light bleeding last night so went to clinic where they did an u/s; too early to really see much but did see a gestational sac; u/s moved from Apr.8th to 15th

Apr.18: First u/s scheduled (at 8 wks).... omg there are twins!!! One had a heartbeat of 140 and the other only 80 so being referred to the head OB of internal fetal medicine as it looks like I may have a vanishing twin which RE said 50% of twins go down to one before the 2nd trimester.

 

 

 

 

 


#4 SunshineTTC

SunshineTTC
  • 1000+
  • 1037 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Regina, SK
  • Dx:DOR
  • My Clinic:VFC

Posted 30 July 2014 - 07:28 PM

I can't answer on the "too many" question, but my clinic considers 6-8 cells the "expected" on day 3, and 2-4 cells expected on day 2.  As said above, sometimes it's a matter of a couple of hours, depending when they assess the embryos vs. when they were fertilized. This morning my 1 retrieved egg was at day 3 and 7 cells for freezing -- I asked if 7 (or an uneven number) was any worse than 8, and the embryologist said no not at all, would probably be 8 within the next hour or 2 (if it weren't frozen first).  I have heard anecdotally that if they divide too fast it may be sign of a problem, but I don't have anything to back that up -- also if they were graded good to excellent, you would think that would take any strange things into account?


Me: 40 41 42 43 44 45, single, FSH 6, LH 2 (FSH not high, but exceeded 2:1 ratio), DOR (AFC 5-7, v.low AMH), all else normal/healthy.

After a difficult 6 year journey of everything going wrong, amazing baby boy born Dec 2018.  Donor sperm + DEB-USA donor eggs.  Detailed journey in 'about me'.

 


#5 TryingForOur2ndChild

TryingForOur2ndChild
  • Global 100+
  • 791 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:London, ON
  • Dx:Male Factor

Posted 01 August 2014 - 03:28 PM

Thank you Sunshine for the information and wishing you all the best of luck with your frozen embie. :)


  • SunshineTTC likes this

See full journey details on my profile:

 

About Us:

​Trying to conceive since 2013 (male factor); Me: 39 yrs old; DH: 37 yrs old; low testosterone; very low sperm count; on Clomid for testosterone

 

~ 2014 ~ IVF Cycle #1:

 

Cycle Info:

- Antagonist protocol

- Retrieval: 22 eggs retrieved; 8 injected (ICSI); 6 fertilized; 4 embryos divided - 2 embryos are 4 cell grade 1, 1 embryo is 5 cell grade 2, and 1 embryo is 8 cell grade 2

 

FET #1 - medicated cycle (2014)

- transferred two day-3s: one 10 cell grade 1 and one 12 cell grade 2; Beta: BFN; approved to do a natural FET next time

 

FET #2 - Non-medicated cycle (2014)

- added Teva-Doxycycline 100mg (antibiotic) started one day before procedure: 1 tab 2xdaily until finished) 

- transferred two day-3 embies (1 is 10 cell grade 2 and 1 is 12 cell grade 2); took 1 tab of Apo-Diazepam (valium) 5mg 45mins before FET        

​- HPT = th_abfp.gifbanana.gifbanana.gifth_abfp.gif  Welcomed our little babygirl.gif in summer of 2015

 

~ 2016/17IVF Cycle #2: Project Sibling

 

Cycle Info:

Oct. 29: Retrieval - 23 eggs retrieved; will be a freeze all cycle

Nov. 2: Dostinex 0.5mg every other day for a total of 8 days has started to alleviate OHSS 

Nov. 4: Day 6 report: 5 embryos on ice... yay! 4 day-5s (4AA and 3 are 4BC quality) and 1 day-6 (5BC quality)

 

FET #1 - Non-medicated cycle (2017)

Feb. 6: start Teva-Doxycycline antibiotic100mg one day before procedure
Feb. 7: scheduled transfer at 11:45am; 1 tab of Apo-Diazepam (valium) 5mg taken 45mins before transfer; transfer of one 4AA blast

Feb.20: BETA - BFN; approved to go right into another natural FET with no cycle in between

 

FET #2 - Non-medicated cycle (2017)

Feb.24: CD3 - u/s and b/w= nothing said about lining; E2 19, LH 4.4 IU/L, FSH 6.6 IU/L, Prolactin 8.1 Ng/mL, TSH 2.22 IU/L, Progesterone 1.6 nmol/L, Glucose 4.1 - I requested (norm is 3.6-7.7); back on CD15; acupuncture 2x weekly until fet to try and bring on LH surge sooner than CD17.

Mar.6: OPK positive in the evening so looks like I will be going into the clinic tomorrow

Mar.7: CD14 - u/s and b/w= 11mm triple lining; E2 712, LH 32 IU/L

Mar.8: CD15 - b/w= confirmed LH surge was yesterday; E2 343, LH 8.12 IU/L; start Endometrin 3x/daily

Mar.11: start Doxycycline antibiotic 100mg (8 pills total) one day before procedure: 1 tab 2xdaily until finished

Mar.12: scheduled transfer at 10am of one 4BA blast; 1 tab of Apo-Diazepam (valium) 5mg taken 45mins before transfer

Mar.23: HPT = th_abfp.gifbanana.gifbanana.gifth_abfp.gif

​Mar.25: Beta #1= 788 hcg, Progesterone 107 nmol/L; RE happy with results so skipping beta #2 and going right to u/s

​Apr.4: had light bleeding last night so went to clinic where they did an u/s; too early to really see much but did see a gestational sac; u/s moved from Apr.8th to 15th

Apr.18: First u/s scheduled (at 8 wks).... omg there are twins!!! One had a heartbeat of 140 and the other only 80 so being referred to the head OB of internal fetal medicine as it looks like I may have a vanishing twin which RE said 50% of twins go down to one before the 2nd trimester.

 

 

 

 

 






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