19 replies to this topic

[babatime]

I am so glad DR McCulloch that you have joined us and thank you so much for your time.

I am gearing up for FET and would like to know if there is anything I could do naturally to increase my uterine lining thickness?

We have done TMC+acupuncture for 1 and a half years both my DH and I with out success.
Then we had 2 IUI, one IVF ( that was poor respond from my part) while also doing acupuncture. ( please check my profile for details on the cycles)
It seems that in a natural cycle my uterine lining don't get beyond or barely gets to 7mm. In worst case only to 4.5mm.
Our second IVF we had plenty of eggs my estrogen (E2) levels were in the 20000's and still only had 7.5mm lining which is boarder line for IVF.
So is there any supplements herbs I could take to improve uterine lining?

Thank you so kindly for your time.
Kat

[DrFionaMcCulloch]

Hi Kat,
Sounds as if you may have low blood flow since E2 was not the problem. L-Arginine is one of the basic things to try for circulation, it improves endometrial receptivity and blood flow in the endometrium by regulating nitric oxide. I also find it's a good idea to make sure your ferritin is above 40-50.
Dose for L-Arginine is usually 2g twice daily.
I also want to mention that if you have herpes or cold sores, L-Arginine may stimulate outbreaks. If it's a mild case you can counter this with lysine. If more severe L-Arginine may not be for you.
Take care,
Dr Fiona

I am so glad DR McCulloch that you have joined us and thank you so much for your time.

I am gearing up for FET and would like to know if there is anything I could do naturally to increase my uterine lining thickness?

We have done TMC+acupuncture for 1 and a half years both my DH and I with out success.
Then we had 2 IUI, one IVF ( that was poor respond from my part) while also doing acupuncture. ( please check my profile for details on the cycles)
It seems that in a natural cycle my uterine lining don't get beyond or barely gets to 7mm. In worst case only to 4.5mm.
Our second IVF we had plenty of eggs my estrogen (E2) levels were in the 20000's and still only had 7.5mm lining which is boarder line for IVF.
So is there any supplements herbs I could take to improve uterine lining?

Thank you so kindly for your time.
Kat

[babatime]

Thank you so kindly for your time and advice.
Will start on that in the morning. ( I have it as I took that at my last cycle)
For ferritin levels do I get a blood test from my GP?


If I could have one more question please.
Can you please tell me about Macca root ( powder or capsules)??
I have read about it and not sure were the scale is on it.

Thank you so much.
Kat

[DrFionaMcCulloch]

Hi Kat,
you can get the ferritin test from your GP, it's a test for stored iron, which is often not done routinely. I've seen clinically that low ferritin can definitely add to poor circulation in cases of thin lining esp in those with good e2 levels.
Maca is mainly an "adaptogen" which means that it reduces the impact of stress on the body and supports the function of the adrenal glands. It has historically/traditionally been used for fertility in both men and women and a few studies have indicated its effectiveness for fertility especially in men. I have noted clinically that it very much increases libido and energy in women. I do recommend it sometimes for female fertility, but only for certain cases. There is some research for its use in peri and post menopausal women and improvement of hormonal parameters in these cases and I have definitely seen that in clinic as well.
Take care,
Dr Fiona

[babatime]

Thank you kindly for your respond and answer. Again.

I did have that test by GP I just didn't know ferritin was stored iron. She said I had great values. Now that I think back My GP did that test the very first. How ever she did find that my vitamin D was boarder line for intervention. It was in the forties, and they like to see it over eighty. I went on supplements for a year and my repeat test was just over eighty.

Thank you so much for your respond to Macca. I guess I can stop taking that, I don't need more libido LOL or energy I need better uterine lining and blood flow.

Thank you so kindly

[DrFionaMcCulloch]

Hi again Kat,
another thing that can be linked to poor pelvic blood flow is cortisol. Cortisol is a stress hormone which is secreted by the adrenal gland, and it is related to poorer blood flow in the uterine artery. This is part of why stress reduces fertility. Even if not elevated to a very high degree, a mild elevation over a long time can cause a decrease in blood flow. This is where the adaptogenic treatments can help as well as stress management practices such as yoga, deep breathing or qi gong.

There are many ways to help reduce cortisol and improve adrenal response and often it can take a few months of treatment with the right protocol to work on this. To really work on this thoroughly it requires lifestyle change with good diet, relaxation techniques, acupuncture, adaptogenic nutrients or plant extracts(Maca is one but there are many some may be more suited to you) and circulatory promoting antioxidants : this process may take around 3 months prior to the cycle.

Cortisol reduces nitric oxide release in the uterine artery, so the l-arginine can help to counter this as it enhances production of nitric oxide. However, working with the body's response to stress is of utmost importance and the combination forms of treatment produce a much better response.
warmest regards
Dr Fiona

[~*Megan*~]

Lots of great info here, I think my lining is our issue as well!
Tks Dr McCulloch

[babatime]

Thank you so much for all this great information DR Fiona.

[RainbowsPromise]

Dr. Fiona, how long would you suggest someone take l-arginine? My herbalist had me on it last year, before we had testing to find out the reasons for our infertility, and I'm gearing up for a donor embryo cycle. I have been off it now for a while but from your info above, I'm thinking I should go back on it. Is it something you can continue to take during pregnancy or should you stop once you've had transfer?

You've shared a ton of great info and already, you're a welcome addition to the forums!

[DrFionaMcCulloch]

Hi Rainbows,
Well, L-Arginine again is not for everyone. If given in cases where it's not needed it actually may reduce quality of embryos as there will be an accumulation of nitric oxide at high levels while the follicle is developing. It is definitely not an across the board treatment for everyone. It tends to be most helpful for those who have had "poor response" in past IVF cycles because what we are looking to do is mimic physiological amounts of this component in those with poor blood flow due to low nitric oxide.

If we give too much, especially in women who respond well normally it may actually be detrimental according to one study. I'd definitely suggest some caution and to find out for sure if it is right for you. I find it very effective when given in the right case. If you have poor blood flow and poor response has happened in the past for you, it may be helpful. I do not recommend it during pregnancy. The amount of time to take it varies from patient to patient depending on overall progress.
warmest regards and thanks for your question!
Dr Fiona

[RainbowsPromise]

Thanks Dr. Fiona. So what you're saying is that a person needs to have a poor uterine lining for this to be effective. My lining's been OK, just my ovaries haven't responded so I'll be doing a FET with embryos that have been donated to us. I think I'll keep up with my acupuncture and forego adding anything else to my regimen.

That's what I love about naturopathic medicine... such an individualized approach! Thanks again!

[DrFionaMcCulloch]

Hi Rainbows,
Did not realize you were doing FET(which I see was in your signature now - how great to have everyone's signatures with so many details)
With FET we don't have to be concerned about too much nitric oxide produced by L - Arginine as we would in IVF(since in IVF we are concerned primarily with follicle health and if nitric oxide is very very high it may be detrimental to follicles development). There is evidence that L-Arg may improve implantation by increasing blood flow and tissue perfusion so may indeed be helpful for FET implantation.

Just wanted to clarify, it may help patients with thin lining generally, OR helps with implantation in those who have had poor responses to IVF previously (even in cases without thin lining since nitric oxide also regulates ovarian function).
The nitric oxide produced by L-Arginine opens the vessels and allows the estrogen to be better delivered to the endometrial tissue(this is how it can thicken the lining).

What I was mentioning in the previous post is one study which shows that it can have negative effects on follicle quality when someone tends to be a good responder(likely because they already have enough nitric oxide and blood flow). For this reason I don't usually recommend it for someone's first IVF, only for those who have had difficulty in previous cycles. Also important to always ok things with your RE for use during the cycle itself.

Hope that clarifies things
Thank you for your question, and take care
Dr Fiona

[RainbowsPromise]

Thanks for that clarification, Dr. Fiona. Now I definitely have something to think about!

[feydruss]

I have a FET in two weeks. Is it too late to start L-arginine now to try to optimize results? I had "attempted implantation" on my first fresh cycle.

[DrFionaMcCulloch]

Hi Fey
It's not too late to get some benefits from it. Although it takes 3 months to really improve these kinds of concerns with an overall nutritional/supplement/acupuncture protocol, the L-Arg may provide some benefits even now if it fits your case. Definitely ask your RE, because he/she would know more about the specifics of your case from your last cycle and if indeed blood flow is a factor!
warmest regards
Dr Fiona

I have a FET in two weeks. Is it too late to start L-arginine now to try to optimize results? I had "attempted implantation" on my first fresh cycle.

[babatime]

I just wanted to bump this thread for Fenn411.
Not sure if it's helpful.

I did get pregnant with a border line lining thickness ( check my profile for details) on a FET cycle. Was on estrace and prometrium much longer than normal, plus used supplements.

[vicky]

hello,

could I take arginine if from time to time I have cold sores?
Thank you

[DrFionaMcCulloch]

Hi vicky,

You can, however it may actually trigger the cold sores to break out. You can counter this with L-Lysine at 1000mg 3x/day at first sign, or at 1000 mg 1x/day as prevention.

Dr Fiona

[vicky]

Hi vicky,

You can, however it may actually trigger the cold sores to break out. You can counter this with L-Lysine at 1000mg 3x/day at first sign, or at 1000 mg 1x/day as prevention.

Dr Fiona

Thank you

wish you a happy new year
t

[hbbg]

Bumping this old old thread, as I just started taking l arginine today in prep for my upcoming natural Fet as I had too thin of a uterine lining to do a fresh transfer.

My question for anyone who has taken it, do you stop before the transfer or continue?

Thank you
🙂