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BFN after IVF - what's next?


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#1 Embrace

Embrace
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  • Dx:Unexplained

Posted 31 March 2008 - 09:45 AM

Hi,

I am searching for something other than IVF and hugely drug based treatments. We just had a BFN from our 1st IVF, have nothing frozen. Seems we have an embryo quality issue which means of the 19 eggs we had at ER, 15 fertilized, but by Day 2-3 only 2 remained even somewhat viable for transfer. Embryologist hypothesized that DH and I likely do make embryo's naturally, but they don't survive after about a day or 2. Without going through this again and spending thousands to study the embryo's and find out why they are disintegrating (if we even could?) I am determined to seek out something alternative that might help this embryo quality improve. I am not ready to give up but know I can't go through IVF again - not without doing something to improve the embryo quality. Any thoughts from the IF vets?

One more question...has anyone ever heard of someone getting preg naturally after IVF? I wondered if our bodies are "hyped" up on hormones and does that mean we have a better "chance" of a natural preg after an IVF cycle?

I know as I reread the post I am grasping at straws...but that's all I feel I have after 5 years of trying, failed IUI's and now a failed IVF. IF sucks and is so heart breaking. Thank you for reading and letting me have a safe place to ask my questions.
me: 34 DH: 35
TTC: 5+ years
DD: 6 yo (natural)
unexplained infertility
2005 - 2 cycles of Clomid & IUI - BFN
Clomid was awful & took us 2 years to figure out next step.
1st IVF - ER March 10 & ET of 2 embies March 13, 2008

BFN - March 29, 2008. No embies frozen.

#2 Ope

Ope
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Posted 31 March 2008 - 10:16 AM

I am so sorry about your BFN. Did you had an after cycle consultation with your RE. What did he/she said?
You had so many eggs, did you had OHSS?
In the last few months I was following all the cyclebuddies topics and I had the impression that many ladies who were overstimulated and had high number of eggs very fast usually do not had good quality embryos. Of course not everybody, but I felt this was the trend. It really seems that very large quantity hurts the quality.
I do not think you always will produce bad quality of embies. Unfortunately the first IVF is a hit and miss first time shot for the RE. Until you start to use the medication, there is no way to know how you are going to react to them. Based on how do you react to the first IVF, your RE will have a much better idea to set your medication for the second time.
I saw that you have unexplained IF, maybe you can do acupuncture to help a bit your natural fertility.
When we found last year that my dh sperm morphology is so bad he started acupuncture once a week and our TCM practicioner gave him some terrible tasting herbs. Although it didn't help with the morphology, but it did increase his sperm motility and vitality a lot and also boost a bit on the count. Who know, you maybe only need a little boost to conceive naturally.
Also you can try acupuncture during the cycle and right before the transfer.Many study shows it increase a chance of implantation. Also my TCM Dr gave me some herb to take during the last AF prior to the IVF. It made my flow a bit heavier and it supposed to ensure that every bit of the lining clears. So every bit of my lining is fresh during the cycle. Also I had twice a week session during the cycle to help my lining.
I wasn't good responder to the meds, we had few embryos(5), and they were not very good quality either. On the other hand, I had beautiful thick lining so it sticked.

#3 Duck

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 12:33 PM

Sorry to hear about the BFN. It's always hard to go through.

I have heard of people getting pg after a round of fertility drugs, the whole hyper fertility thing, so it is possible.

I was concerned about egg quality (as well as not making eggs) before going into the ivf cycle. So i did acupuncture, fertility yoga, and took vitamins for 6 months prep before ivf. Acupuncture alone has helped women get pg, with out ivf (we're not doing just alternative treatments, because it would not work for me, my bodys too messed). Everything i did do, really really helped my cycle, i got 10 eggs (the RE thought I would get 3 or 4 if I was lucky), so it all worked out that way.

I didn't get pg, because my lining was only 2.5 (they think i may have had a bacterial infection of some sort).

A great book to check out if your interested in alternative options is Randine Lewis's The Fertility Cure.


If you did do another ivf cycle, your RE may lower the amount of stims, in the hopes of less eggs, better quality.

Diagnosed with endometrosis at age 19

5 pelvic surgeries

2 IVF, numerous FETs

2 different gestational carriers

Now mother of 2 year old twins.


#4 baby2be

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 12:38 PM

Embrace, I am so sorry about your negative outcome. My embryos were not that great, because I have PCOS, so this last cycle RE added dexamathsone (sp) and we had much better embryos this time around. Sadly no pg, but we were able to freeze 8 blasts. Ask your RE about it.

Best of luck to you!

Hugs,
Dana
ME-30 DH-39
TTC 8 years
1st IVF May/June 2006- Chem pg
2 FETs-BFN
PCOS, Damaged Tubes
Tubes removed May 2007
2nd. IVF Oct/ Nov 2007- BFN
3rd. IVF Feb/ March 2008- BFN
3rd. FET July/ Aug 2008- BFP Beta 6dp5dt 9, 8dp5dt 45, 11dp5dt 131, 15dp5dt 971, 21dp5dt 3060
4th. FET July 29th, 2010.
BETA 5.5dp5dt 14.6, 7.5dp5dt 53.6,10.5dp5dt 149.4,17.5dp5dt 1902, 19.5dp5dt 3282
Ultrasound showed one little bean!!

Vanessa arrived April 28, 2009!!!
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Jaydan arrived April 9, 2011
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#5 stillhoping

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 01:47 PM

Very sorry about your BFN. It is so disappointing. I had 10 good quality eggs and 7 good quality embryos but nothing left to freeze unfortunately, so I can sympathize with your experience a bit. I have heard that TCM can help with both egg quality and sperm quality. I am currently receiving acupuncture and making diet changes in hopes of improving quality and chance of BFP after next IVF w. ICSI. My husband is also undergoing treatment to improve his sperm quality. Sometimes, changes in diet, lifestyle, stress reaction, etc. along with acupuncture and TCM can encourage a pregnancy the old-fashioned way, but everyone's individual, so depends on your situation of course. Eggs take around 90 days to develop, apparently, which is why many TCM recommend beginning treatments 3 months before. However, studies have been done showing acupuncture immediately before and after transfer can help as well. If sperm is an issue, I've heard sperm takes 72-90 days to develop, so it's a similar time frame for improving overall sperm quality. (I think! Don't quote me...) My TCM recommended a minimum of 6 wks treatment before IVF cycle. I hope it all works out for you. Good luck.
Me 42 and holding...; DH 41, counting normally.
TTC 6 years or so... have lost count
5 IUI's, 1 cancelled IVF, 2 full ones
Jan 2008 IVF - 13 eggs, 9 mature, 7 fertilized, 2 made it to blast, 1 to morula. BFN.
March 2009 IVF
ER - many, many follicles; 10 eggs, 9 mature, 6 fertilized
ET - transferred 4 embies on Day 3.
First beta = 61.
Second beta = 17. Chemical pregnancy.
Looked at options but now trying to let go....getting closer but still hanging around this site. I don't know why.
Smoking big cigars, drinking daily beers and tequila, and eating a lot of cake. (kidding, except for the cake maybe....)

#6 Embrace

Embrace
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  • Dx:Unexplained

Posted 31 March 2008 - 08:40 PM

Thank you for your replies and advice. I have booked in with a naturopath in a week's time. Hopefully my ovary swelling will be a bit down by then. I am still very swollen and hurting. I am surprised to be feeling this way after the BFN! I sort of hoped once stopping the meds my body would begin AF and return to normal. Well, it is only day 3 of no meds so i guess I need to be patient! So my quest for a more natural process continues...I'll keep you posted if I find out anything interesting :)
me: 34 DH: 35
TTC: 5+ years
DD: 6 yo (natural)
unexplained infertility
2005 - 2 cycles of Clomid & IUI - BFN
Clomid was awful & took us 2 years to figure out next step.
1st IVF - ER March 10 & ET of 2 embies March 13, 2008

BFN - March 29, 2008. No embies frozen.