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FET - Thin Lining. What did you do? Estrace vs Estradot? Advice Needed!


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#51 4 years and counting

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Posted 04 November 2016 - 11:28 AM

amazing grace - i have had my cycles transfer 8 times due to lining.....If this protocol doesn't work, as estrace is involved, I would love to suggest your protocol, what was the specifics for the protocol? do you remember the day 1 - transfer protocol?


Me 43, DH 43

 

Trying since 2012
Natural Pregnancy May 2012, ended blighted ovum
Natural Pregnancy June 2013, miscarriage 6 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

Natural Pregnancy January 2014, miscarriage 8 weeks

IVF Pregnancy December 2016, miscarriage 4 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

 

First clinic 2012-2014

Second clinic 2014-present

 

Dx: diminished ovarian reserve; thin lining

 

Unsuccessful protocols: estrace, estradot patches, gonal f, natural cycle

 

Lining gets to 8.0 mm

 

Using donor eggs

 

FET attempts 15, transferred 2 times (1 BFN, 1 BFP), cycles canceled 13.

 


#52 ms-tdot

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Posted 07 November 2016 - 09:22 AM

4 years, did you start your Estrace and viagra as scheduled?

#53 4 years and counting

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Posted 07 November 2016 - 09:36 AM

Ms-tdot - I started yesterday on schedule. My numbers were normal from blood test on Friday. I have to warn you; the Viagra is so expensive (almost $400). As well, this is going to be TMI, but it is super messy. I really don't think my body absorbs Estrace. I go back in on the 16th for ultrasound only.
  • ms-tdot likes this

Me 43, DH 43

 

Trying since 2012
Natural Pregnancy May 2012, ended blighted ovum
Natural Pregnancy June 2013, miscarriage 6 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

Natural Pregnancy January 2014, miscarriage 8 weeks

IVF Pregnancy December 2016, miscarriage 4 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

 

First clinic 2012-2014

Second clinic 2014-present

 

Dx: diminished ovarian reserve; thin lining

 

Unsuccessful protocols: estrace, estradot patches, gonal f, natural cycle

 

Lining gets to 8.0 mm

 

Using donor eggs

 

FET attempts 15, transferred 2 times (1 BFN, 1 BFP), cycles canceled 13.

 


#54 ms-tdot

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Posted 07 November 2016 - 11:22 AM

$400 for the whole protocol period? For my last FET I paid $3000 for low dose stims that did nothing, so $400 sounds fine to me (unless it's per day). Also, FYI, I had a full period a few days after stopping bcp - not just light spotting.

#55 4 years and counting

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Posted 07 November 2016 - 11:27 AM

Ms-tdot - just for the Viagra for whole protocol. You are right, it doesn't seem that unreasonable in comparison. I guess I was just shocked as this was not covered by my plan whereas others are. But you are right, there are others meds much more money.

Me 43, DH 43

 

Trying since 2012
Natural Pregnancy May 2012, ended blighted ovum
Natural Pregnancy June 2013, miscarriage 6 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

Natural Pregnancy January 2014, miscarriage 8 weeks

IVF Pregnancy December 2016, miscarriage 4 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

 

First clinic 2012-2014

Second clinic 2014-present

 

Dx: diminished ovarian reserve; thin lining

 

Unsuccessful protocols: estrace, estradot patches, gonal f, natural cycle

 

Lining gets to 8.0 mm

 

Using donor eggs

 

FET attempts 15, transferred 2 times (1 BFN, 1 BFP), cycles canceled 13.

 


#56 cherbear

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Posted 07 November 2016 - 01:02 PM

$400 for the whole protocol period? For my last FET I paid $3000 for low dose stims that did nothing, so $400 sounds fine to me (unless it's per day). Also, FYI, I had a full period a few days after stopping bcp - not just light spotting.


Interesting you noted the cost of your low-dose FET cycle. I just made a post asking about this. I should have just asked here first, as some of you have probably already been through this. Duh! Does that $3000 include your clinic's fee, etc? Or was that just for meds? We are debating if we should just jump right to a fresh cycle if the patches don't work, rather than doing the low-dose stim FET. From what I can estimate the cost would be about $5000 more to do a fresh, but I'm thinking we're gonna spend thousands on a stim FET, then require a fresh cycle anyway. At least with a fresh cycle we'll get more embryos to use.

Anyone else done a low-dose stim FET want to share costs and experience vs a fresh cycle?

Me: 35 DH: 33
Dec 2005 - ectopic #1 in right tube (lap surgery, tube saved)
Actively TTC since May 2012
March 2013 - ectopic #2 in right tube (treated with MTX)
July 2013 - HSG revealed left tube completely blocked, right tube open, uterine scarring
August 2013 referred to PCRM
Oct 2013 - hysteroscopy and exploratory lap surgery. Scar tissue removed from uterus.
IVF #1
Nov 13th 2013 - Dec 19th 2013 - suppression with BCP (Marvelon)Dec 24th 2013 - start 200 IU Puregon + 75 IU Menopur
Jan 4 2014 - ER (25 eggs, 23 mature, 15 fertilized)
Jan 9 2014 - ET (transferred 2 beautiful 5-day blasts - 4AA and 3AA) 3 frosties remaining
Jan 15 2014 - BFP!!!! th_abfp.gif
Jan 18 - Beta #1 @ 9dp5dt = 210, Jan 20 - Beta #2 @ 11dp5dt = 534!!! A baby is on the way!! yahoo.gif EDD Sept 27 2014
Sept 22nd 2014 - Myles David was born @ 3:27 am babyboy.gif We are so in love with this little boy! heart.gif

Sept 2015 - early miscarriage at about 5 weeks sad.png
Nov 2015 - BFP (natural conception) - no heartbeat at 8 week u/s icon_cry.gifSuspected molar pregnancy (22/12/15);Jan 2016 - 2 unsuccessful rounds of misoprostal - D&C required; April 2016 - repeat D&C for retained products - Pathology and cytogenetics confirmed a partial molar pregnancy.Oncologist advised waiting 6 months before TTC again.  

FET #1
Sept/Oct 2016 - Mock cycle (Estrace) = FAIL! Lining maxed out at 4.5mm
Oct/Nov 2016 - Natural cycle = FAIL!  Lining 4.2mm
Nov/Dec 2016 - Estradot Patch cycle - Come on lining!!! eusa_wall.gif


#57 schlepp

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Posted 07 November 2016 - 04:22 PM

My RE has given my a protocol of estrogen patches and viagara for my next try. I'm going to do cycle monitoring first but have to wait and see if AF arrives in a window that allows for it. Lots of travel in Dec so this might all wait until January. He wasn't particularly hopeful and just kept telling me to see their naturopath. I already have one and have not been impressed with the clinic advertising for their naturopath. A lot of fear mongering and weight shaming in their add. Only positive from the meeting was that my 5mm lining is triple stripe. Just thin.

In the meantime, I'm starting some different supplements (black cohosh, l arginine and Vit E) and am going to try a new acupuncturist that specializes in fertility to do some treatment outside of a cycle.

The RE said if I don't get to 8 on the monitoring cycle or the next medicated cycle he will do a biopsy to get a closer look at the cells of the my lining.

Cherbear - Good luck on the low dose stim option. I thought FETs were supposed to be cheap and easy...apparently my uterus missed that memo.

See my 'about me' page for treatment history.


#58 schlepp

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Posted 09 November 2016 - 10:54 AM

I met with a new acupuncturist that specializes in fertility yesterday. He is very positive and I'm looking forward to working with him. He did mention that the study that showed that acupucture increases lining was for 3 months, twice a week. That is $2000 worth of treatment...

Anyone try a different protocol? He said I could also just do the protocol when I'm cycling. I might try that with a monitoring cycle and supplements and see where I get to.

See my 'about me' page for treatment history.


#59 lumnay

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Posted 09 November 2016 - 08:04 PM

Hi there. I'm doing low dose stims during my FET cycle.

I used Puregon and it got my lining thick enough (7.5) by CD 15. I will have my transfer (2 frozen) in 2 days. This almost feels like a natural cycle (no Estrace just Puregon) but because I have lots of follicles (d/t PCOS) I had to be monitored closely (every 2-3 days). I'm currently on luteal support (low dose Estrace and 2x Crinone) and I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

To prepare for cycle, I've been taking prenatal vitamins, CoQ10, folic acid, Iron, Zinc, Aspirin, Synthroid, and switched in to high-fiber and dairy-free diet. Honestly, I don't think all these helped me much as I believe it's the stims that helped my lining. I would have added acupuncture this cycle but I just cannot afford it. I guess I'll wait and see if this cycle/protocol will give me success.
  • shelan likes this

Who stole ambushed my stork?  So many failed cycles with nothing to show but bills, receipts, and empty bottles of medications/herbs/supplements. See my profile for details... 

 

Kindly save your sticky vibes and baby dust and send them to those who are new and excited in this journey. 

 

 


#60 cherbear

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Posted 10 November 2016 - 12:16 AM

Hi there. I'm doing low dose stims during my FET cycle.

I used Puregon and it got my lining thick enough (7.5) by CD 15. I will have my transfer (2 frozen) in 2 days. This almost feels like a natural cycle (no Estrace just Puregon) but because I have lots of follicles (d/t PCOS) I had to be monitored closely (every 2-3 days). I'm currently on luteal support (low dose Estrace and 2x Crinone) and I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

To prepare for cycle, I've been taking prenatal vitamins, CoQ10, folic acid, Iron, Zinc, Aspirin, Synthroid, and switched in to high-fiber and dairy-free diet. Honestly, I don't think all these helped me much as I believe it's the stims that helped my lining. I would have added acupuncture this cycle but I just cannot afford it. I guess I'll wait and see if this cycle/protocol will give me success.

lumnay - welcome! Did you try any other protocols before moving to a low-dose stim cycle? I've tried Estrace (orally and vaginally), and a Natural cycle, with no success. My lining won't budge past 4.5mm. Next up is estrogen patches, but I'm not expecting that to work either. After that we will move on to low-dose stims. I'm hoping to hear from someone for whom low-dose stims worked on their lining when exogenous estrogen failed. I want to know there's still hope for my lining 😕
  • shelan likes this

Me: 35 DH: 33
Dec 2005 - ectopic #1 in right tube (lap surgery, tube saved)
Actively TTC since May 2012
March 2013 - ectopic #2 in right tube (treated with MTX)
July 2013 - HSG revealed left tube completely blocked, right tube open, uterine scarring
August 2013 referred to PCRM
Oct 2013 - hysteroscopy and exploratory lap surgery. Scar tissue removed from uterus.
IVF #1
Nov 13th 2013 - Dec 19th 2013 - suppression with BCP (Marvelon)Dec 24th 2013 - start 200 IU Puregon + 75 IU Menopur
Jan 4 2014 - ER (25 eggs, 23 mature, 15 fertilized)
Jan 9 2014 - ET (transferred 2 beautiful 5-day blasts - 4AA and 3AA) 3 frosties remaining
Jan 15 2014 - BFP!!!! th_abfp.gif
Jan 18 - Beta #1 @ 9dp5dt = 210, Jan 20 - Beta #2 @ 11dp5dt = 534!!! A baby is on the way!! yahoo.gif EDD Sept 27 2014
Sept 22nd 2014 - Myles David was born @ 3:27 am babyboy.gif We are so in love with this little boy! heart.gif

Sept 2015 - early miscarriage at about 5 weeks sad.png
Nov 2015 - BFP (natural conception) - no heartbeat at 8 week u/s icon_cry.gifSuspected molar pregnancy (22/12/15);Jan 2016 - 2 unsuccessful rounds of misoprostal - D&C required; April 2016 - repeat D&C for retained products - Pathology and cytogenetics confirmed a partial molar pregnancy.Oncologist advised waiting 6 months before TTC again.  

FET #1
Sept/Oct 2016 - Mock cycle (Estrace) = FAIL! Lining maxed out at 4.5mm
Oct/Nov 2016 - Natural cycle = FAIL!  Lining 4.2mm
Nov/Dec 2016 - Estradot Patch cycle - Come on lining!!! eusa_wall.gif


#61 lumnay

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Posted 10 November 2016 - 12:29 AM

Cherbear, yes I did 3 FET cycles. Only one resulted in a chemical (beta dropped). High dose Estrace (3x orally, then the other cycles 3x orally and 2x vaginally) didn't work for me. Doing low dose stim have given me the thickest lining at CD14-15 whereas I would have to wait until CD28-32 before to get something close to my lining this cycle. Puregon isn't cheap but so far I'd say it's working... A few days ago I saw a few big follicles so maybe those are really helping me with the lining. I'll have my transfer on Friday so we'll see. Good luck!

Who stole ambushed my stork?  So many failed cycles with nothing to show but bills, receipts, and empty bottles of medications/herbs/supplements. See my profile for details... 

 

Kindly save your sticky vibes and baby dust and send them to those who are new and excited in this journey. 

 

 


#62 Mamacee

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Posted 14 November 2016 - 10:02 PM

Hey everyone. I have just started following this thread and already found it very helpful.
I am trying to prepare for my 3 fet. Last two have been cancelled due to thin lining.
Have tried estrace 3 times orallly and just tried valerate injections which gave me the thinnest lining yet. Can't seem to get thicker then 6. Dr. Said my highest lining was with a fresh cycle and got to 8,5 so we are trying a "supernatural" cycle of letrazole and low does gonal f. Hoping this along with acupuncture, vit e and pomegranate juice will do the trick. I have a very small separate uterus and the dr. Said he has seen it quite common in women with this to have problems getting a thick lining. I guess we will see how it goes. Does anyone know if this combination produces follicles again? I am a little confused on what these meds do and have not had a chance to chat about it.

#63 schlepp

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Posted 17 November 2016 - 09:36 AM

Mamacee - I would think it would definitely encourage follicle growth but at low doses, not at much as during an IVF cycle. If you read above lumnay says she has a few big follicles going.

 

Has anyone read this Dr Sher article on the use of viagara? http://drgeoffreyshe...uterine-lining/

 

I am wondering about asking around to find a pharmacy that will compound the viagara into suppositories, rather than just throwing the pills in. I am going to ask Shoppers Drugmart but wonder if anyone in the GTA has had experience with this. 


See my 'about me' page for treatment history.


#64 returnable

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Posted 17 November 2016 - 09:51 AM

I don't have personal experience, but I found this pharmacy in Toronto that will do it:

 

http://www.smithspha...B8D577B01E035A1

 

 

You need a doctor's prescription for the alternate method of dosing however, not just the pill strength.


  • schlepp likes this

Two IVFs and no chromosomally normal blasts to transfer...we are done with my eggs.


#65 schlepp

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Posted 17 November 2016 - 03:20 PM

Thanks returnable. I will follow up with my RE on getting in the compound form when I try to cycle. I am sure it will be pricey but I think worth it if it is even a little bit more effective.


See my 'about me' page for treatment history.


#66 ms-tdot

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Posted 26 November 2016 - 03:24 PM

I am now on 2 weeks of Viagra and estrace - stuck at 4mm. But we're going to keep going to see if longer exposure to estrogen works. My RE has her pharmacy (pace in Toronto) make the suppositories. It cost 450 for 80 (20 mg each).

#67 4 years and counting

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Posted 26 November 2016 - 03:36 PM

Ms-tot Are you using Estrace or patches?

Me 43, DH 43

 

Trying since 2012
Natural Pregnancy May 2012, ended blighted ovum
Natural Pregnancy June 2013, miscarriage 6 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

Natural Pregnancy January 2014, miscarriage 8 weeks

IVF Pregnancy December 2016, miscarriage 4 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

 

First clinic 2012-2014

Second clinic 2014-present

 

Dx: diminished ovarian reserve; thin lining

 

Unsuccessful protocols: estrace, estradot patches, gonal f, natural cycle

 

Lining gets to 8.0 mm

 

Using donor eggs

 

FET attempts 15, transferred 2 times (1 BFN, 1 BFP), cycles canceled 13.

 


#68 amazing grace

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Posted 26 November 2016 - 08:30 PM

Sorry for the late response 4 years. To answer your question, on day 1 my RE starts me on 0.5mg of estrace vaginally for one week. With that I am on two climara patches and 20mg of tomaxofin. Tomaxofin is administered orally for two weeks. After a week, he increases my estrace to 1mg vaginally and adds another patch so a total of three. I change the patches after one week. I usually go in for a check after each week and by the third week I am up to 1.5mg of vaginal estrace and four patches. This protocol has given me the best outcome. On my day 3, my RE does a neupogen wash as well. I hope it helps and if you have any other questions, please pm me, sometimes I don't see the posts. Good luck!



#69 schlepp

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Posted 27 November 2016 - 08:47 PM

I am now on 2 weeks of Viagra and estrace - stuck at 4mm. But we're going to keep going to see if longer exposure to estrogen works. My RE has her pharmacy (pace in Toronto) make the suppositories. It cost 450 for 80 (20 mg each).


80? They are three a day? I feel like rx for regularly viagara is for 45 pills. And they are 3x a day. So RE is giving me enough for 15 days. Will have to go back and get the speck of rx for the suppositories.

I'm feeling like I jumped the gun on the supplements. Realizing with my AF schedule I'll have done 3.5 months of them before I get to my next medicated try in February.

I'm cheering for you ms tdot!!! Keep us updated.

See my 'about me' page for treatment history.


#70 4 years and counting

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Posted 28 November 2016 - 08:27 AM

All you thin lining ladies, when you were able to transfer, did your lining decrease after start of progesterone? My lining finally got to 9 but scared it will decrease before transfer. I have started progesterone.

Me 43, DH 43

 

Trying since 2012
Natural Pregnancy May 2012, ended blighted ovum
Natural Pregnancy June 2013, miscarriage 6 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

Natural Pregnancy January 2014, miscarriage 8 weeks

IVF Pregnancy December 2016, miscarriage 4 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

 

First clinic 2012-2014

Second clinic 2014-present

 

Dx: diminished ovarian reserve; thin lining

 

Unsuccessful protocols: estrace, estradot patches, gonal f, natural cycle

 

Lining gets to 8.0 mm

 

Using donor eggs

 

FET attempts 15, transferred 2 times (1 BFN, 1 BFP), cycles canceled 13.

 


#71 ms-tdot

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Posted 29 November 2016 - 09:38 PM

4 Years and Counting, you got to 9mm? Amazing! Did you stick with the Yale protocol? I am firmly stuck at 4mm after almost 3 weeks of vaginal estrace, vaginal viagra and baby aspirin. Also have a lot of fluid. We're going to do one more lining check on Saturday and if it's still a garbage lining, we're going to cancel.

 

My understanding is that the lining compresses somewhat after you introduce the progesterone - I don't think all REs even measure the lining afterwards.

 

After this cycle gets cancelled, I'm going to try to tamoxifen. Has anyone here tried and been successful?



#72 4 years and counting

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Posted 29 November 2016 - 09:45 PM

My lining was crap until I added the patches. I firmly believe the Estrace doesn't do anything; patches work for me. Maybe ask to add patches

Me 43, DH 43

 

Trying since 2012
Natural Pregnancy May 2012, ended blighted ovum
Natural Pregnancy June 2013, miscarriage 6 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

Natural Pregnancy January 2014, miscarriage 8 weeks

IVF Pregnancy December 2016, miscarriage 4 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

 

First clinic 2012-2014

Second clinic 2014-present

 

Dx: diminished ovarian reserve; thin lining

 

Unsuccessful protocols: estrace, estradot patches, gonal f, natural cycle

 

Lining gets to 8.0 mm

 

Using donor eggs

 

FET attempts 15, transferred 2 times (1 BFN, 1 BFP), cycles canceled 13.

 


#73 ms-tdot

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Posted 29 November 2016 - 09:47 PM

4 Years, what is the name of the patch? I'm so excited for you - you've given me new hope!



#74 4 years and counting

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Posted 29 November 2016 - 09:53 PM

Estradot patch - changed my lining from 5 to 6.4 in three days and then to 9 in another 3 days

Me 43, DH 43

 

Trying since 2012
Natural Pregnancy May 2012, ended blighted ovum
Natural Pregnancy June 2013, miscarriage 6 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

Natural Pregnancy January 2014, miscarriage 8 weeks

IVF Pregnancy December 2016, miscarriage 4 weeks (chemical pregnancy)

 

First clinic 2012-2014

Second clinic 2014-present

 

Dx: diminished ovarian reserve; thin lining

 

Unsuccessful protocols: estrace, estradot patches, gonal f, natural cycle

 

Lining gets to 8.0 mm

 

Using donor eggs

 

FET attempts 15, transferred 2 times (1 BFN, 1 BFP), cycles canceled 13.

 


#75 ms-tdot

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Posted 29 November 2016 - 09:56 PM

4 Years, this was after you had already been on Estrace for a couple of weeks?