9 replies to this topic

[kittiwakes]

Hi Everyone,

 

My first IVF cycle just failed and I have little hope remaining for future cycles. Any advice/encouragement would really be appreciated!

 

I'm 35 and I was only diagnosed with endo last November after many, many years of misdiagnosis. Everything from IBS to migraines to "it's just a woman's curse so deal with it". The diagnosis was devastating and my husband and I were told to go straight to IVF. I have a small endometrioma on my left ovary and my right tube is blocked. My husband has low sperm motility and morphology, but enough to get the job done.

 

I was on Lupron for two weeks before starting Follistim. I responded very well producing 20 follicles (10 or so each side) and so I duped myself into believing the cycle was going very well. At egg retrieval they collected 11 eggs and they had to puncture through my endometrioma to get to the ones in the left ovary. I was not too happy about that. Will the punctured endometrioma hurt my future eggs?

 

But, at this point I still thought everything was going fine. And then the phone call from the embryologist came and we were told only one egg fertilized, but it wasn't growing. Out of 11 eggs!!! I was shocked. They ICSI'd two eggs at the beginning, but one broke apart and the other one didn't divide. Only 4 of my remaining eggs looked normal, all of the rest were immature and low quality. Of the 4 remaining eggs none were fertilized by my husband's sperm. Next time they said they would ICSI all of the eggs, but I'm wondering if since the two they did this round didn't fertilize, what's the likelihood the next ones will? It's obvious I have an egg quality issue.

 

The one fertilized egg ended up dividing into two cells on Day 3 (way too late for an embryo) but they opted to transfer it. It was a waste of time I think and only led to a painful two week wait. I also started my period on 11dp3dt which was one day before my Beta. I didn't think that was supposed to happen on progesterone supplements.

 

Could the eggs have been too immature because I didn't take enough HGT at trigger time? I only took one injection worth and I've heard of others using two. It was subcutaneous and not intramuscular. Or am I just duping myself again and it's just the endo's fault?

 

What can I do to prepare for the next cycle? My doctor refuses to look into Intralipid therapy or check my natural killer cells because she doesn't think there's enough evidence for it. She also says she wouldn't look into it unless I became pregnant and then miscarried. I think that's a rotten way to go about planning things.

 

We're looking to try again in 1-2 months. Thanks so much for reading all of this and I really appreciate your advice!!!

[ENF]

Hi Kittiwakes,

 

I don't have any advice on Endometriosis but my RE at Victoria Fertility Clinic deals with lots of tough cases and has invaluable advice listed on the clinic's website, including how to increase your chances of success during IVF. Check out the link and then look through the various handouts:

http://www.victoriaf...rmation-sheets/

 

Particularly this handout: http://www.victoriaf...bedoingnow..pdf

 

Through my reading about IVF I came across statistics that it can take 3 or 4 tries before success is achieved through IVF. This makes sense when considering the first IVF cycle is often just an educated guess on what protocol and meds will work for a woman. Subsequent tries are adjusted accordingly. Talk to your RE about the changes that need to happen for your next cycle as well as ways to improve your egg quality. The second link I posted has great ideas for egg quality including Alpha Lipoic Acid, Vitamin D, Co Enzyme Q10, myoinositol, etc. 

 

Best of luck to you. My DH and I just experienced a chemical pregnancy on our first try and it was a real wake up call for our expectations on this journey. Unfortunately patience isn't my best quality but it seems like a lot is needed while going through IVF. 

[ENF]

I forgot to mention that I took 10,000 units of hcg subcutaneously as my trigger (just one needle). I think it is the norm but hopefully others will post too.

[kittiwakes]

Thanks ENF! Wow, those info sheets are very helpful. I'm jealous of your clinic. I'm in the states and I go to Yale Fertility, but unfortunately it's not very good. You'd think the Yale name would improve things, but the staff is incredibly unorganized and I find their approaches to be way too conservative.

 

Thanks for the positive comment about number of tries before IVF works and that I should keep trying. I'm just really upset today because I watched a YouTube video where a doctor gives advice about when you should quit trying. He said if you produce poor quality embryos on your 1st IVF you should quit trying and not even try for a second cycle!!! This is devastating to me. I'm not ready to give up and the fact that this may never work is hard for me to handle. I can't afford egg donation.

[Tejat]

I echo the 3-4 attempts and the supplement regime. I also only triggered with one needle. My DH poor morphology/low motility as well and we HAD to do ICSI per my clinic - they had to hand pick the sperm. I adored my RE and totally trusted him. Each cycle was full team work with me helping to decide protocol etc. Ended up with success on a mini ivf as I was 39 and so was a candidate for quality over quantity (half the stims, fewer eggs but ended up only 2 less than full stim cycles). Also way cheaper.

 

I'm sorry I'm not much help on the endo side. They suspected but it was ruled out so never went down that route. I'm sorry to hear it took so long for you to get a proper diagnosis. Poke around this site for sure for other endo sufferers and perhaps some articles.

 

Get your hubby on the coQ-10 (or ubiquinol which is same but absorbed faster) and the vitamin D. We were both on 600mg/day ubiquinol each cycle and both saw improvement each round in terms of AFC, morph, sperm count ... He was also on a male fertility supplement.

 

I know you want to hear this like a hole in the head but I'm telling you anyways... I am one of so many people I know who only had one good embryo in many. She's alseep upstairs. Stick with it and don't get too discouraged. It's quite a journey.

[Kathryn2013]

Hi kittiwakes,

I also have endo and I'll give you a quick run down of my experience;

- IVF #1; my AFC day 3 was 20. They expected I would be dealing with OHSS so was given Puregon 125. Day 6 u/s showed basically 4 leading follices, they recommended an IUI but I felt that wouldn't work b/c of the endo and pushed for IVF, they doubled my dose and I triggered on day 9 or 10. They took 10 eggs, I think 5 fertilized, there was fragmenting (unsure of the percentages), did a day 3 transfer of 2 embies (5 cell), nothing made it to day 5 and it was a BFN. My trigger was 10,000HCG. At my WTF appt, they told me that I likely had an egg quality issue and DOR. I went and got a second opinion.

- IVF #2; new clinic. Took CoQ10, vit D, vit C, fish oil, melatonin for egg quality for 4 months and Wobenzym N for inflammation (it's recommended to be taking supplements for at least 3 months prior but something is better than nothing I say). I also did a new protocol that consisted of Puregon 150, Repronex 150, dexamethason. They retrieved 17, 14 mature, 13 fertilized and 6 good graded blastocysts are in the freezer. I'll be doing a FET b/c of OHSS risk. I triggered with 5000 HCG this time b/c my estrogen was high. I stimmed longer this cycle and even on day 3, my embies weren't all 8 cell but by day 5, I have some beautiful blasts apparently I'll be doing intralipids before my transfer, hoping for a summer FET.

 

If you're able to, I would highly recommend getting a second opinion. It's made a huge difference for us and we just love our new clinic. This is a business and good or bad, some clinics really are only concerned with bottom lines/statistics/etc. which can make it very discouraging sometimes. Definitely don't count yourself out after one try. I also go to the same clinic as ENF and Victoria has some helpful info sheets.

[kittiwakes]

ENF - thanks again and I'm really sorry about your chemical. I've never seen a positive test and so I guess the silver lining is you know you can get pregnant. But, maybe that isn't a silver lining at all. Maybe it just feels worse? :-( I really hope your FET goes well. Must at least feel really good to have frosties!!

 

Tejat - I didn't realize my husband needed to take the CoQ and Vitamin D, too. Thanks! Your comment about the one good embryo in many made me tear up, but happy/wishful tears. Let's hope I'll be one of the luck ones, too.

 

Kathryn - good luck with the FET!!! I've never heard of Wobenzym N. Did your RE recommend it? How much/often do I take it? We'll stay at the same clinic for IVF#2 because my Yale insurance covers it if I go to the Yale fertility clinic. If that cycle fails, we're moving to Germany in August and we might try there. The government covers 50% there and I think it's cheaper anyway (fingers crossed!).

[Kathryn2013]

No, the Wobenzyme was a recommendation from a Chinese herbalist I saw. I did my research first and like some things are, there isn't conclusive evidence but I gave it a shot anyways (what haven't I tried...haha) and it really changed my periods. My first AF was the worst I've ever had. I normally take morphine throughout and that wasn't even touching it. It was so heavy with so much clotting. The next AF was completely different; I only needed morphine twice and took tramacet the rest of the time. The last AF before IVF, I only needed morphine one night and was able to work the entire time. The herbalist said that the enzyme is really strong and likely cleaned me out with the first AF.

 

I purchased it from iHerb.com and you take 3 pills/twice a day, 45min before food. I feel like a found a little piece of magic for me and my hellish periods lol. Feel free to PM me if you want to chat more about supplements

[kittiwakes]

Thanks for the info on the supplement! I have to try anything I can. I just spent the last hour very distraught because I found an old post by someone named Rubies. She said she had no fertilization either and embryos that never made it past the two cell stage and she was told to give up. I just don't understand why some women with endo have a hard time producing any eggs, but the eggs they produce are fine and then someone like me and Rubies produce lots of eggs, but none of them are any good. It's just so hard to deal with. I can't imagine myself without a child and my husband and I can't afford adoption or egg donation. Okay, I'm back to crying again. I need to be optimistic before my next attempt, but I feel like all hope is lost. Sorry for my negativity. Those of you who can stay positive I really envy. I'm seeing a therapist, but even that isn't helping. I need to try and stay strong for my husband, especially since I'm the one to blame, but it's just so so hard.

[ENF]

ENF - thanks again and I'm really sorry about your chemical. I've never seen a positive test and so I guess the silver lining is you know you can get pregnant. But, maybe that isn't a silver lining at all. Maybe it just feels worse? :-( I really hope your FET goes well. Must at least feel really good to have frosties!!

 

 

You are welcome! I would suggest a second opinion or switching clinics if at all possible. I'd try supplements for three months and then try another cycle and see how it goes. I know many women on here who have tried numerous cycles and it took awhile before they achieved success. Check out the threads under the Endo subject, you should get lots of valuable information from the women on those threads.

 

Oh no it doesn't feel worse, I just want to talk to my RE about why he thinks we had a chemical. I would think it was chromosomal versus anything wrong with my lining or uterus. I've had two pregnancies in the past and conceived naturally and easily (with my ex-husband). The only reason we need to do IVF with ICSI is that my husband is paraplegic. 

 

Take care!